Aggiornato:
Grazie per tutte le vostre risposte Se qualcuno si imbatte qui e trova utili le informazioni, sto facendo un elenco condensato qui in alto.
Il mio articolo di Helsinki con alcune nozioni di base sulle banche. Molte persone hanno avuto una svolta molto rapida quando si sono trasferite in Finlandia. Un mese dalla data del trasloco all’ottenimento del prestito per l’acquisto di una casa. Per aprire un conto bancario potrebbe essere necessario stabilire prima la residenza.
Documento Vero con indicazioni dettagliate sulla residenza fiscale. Questo viene da Vero. La sezione 5.1 parla della residenza fiscale e della riscossione in relazione ai trattati fiscali.
Link all’IRS/Trattato fiscale finlandese.
Pagina DVV intitolata "trasferirsi in Finlandia"
I miei prossimi passi sono: inviare un’e-mail e/o chiamare una banca per chiedere direttamente informazioni su:
1. Aprire un conto mentre non si vive in Finlandia.
2. Richiedere un mutuo per la casa mentre non si vive in Finlandia.
3. Contattare un agente immobiliare finlandese.
4. Acquista l’appartamento in 2-5 anni.
5. Ritirati nel mio progetto di vita transnazionale!
Grazie ancora!
Di seguito è riportato il post originale:
Sono in fase di pianificazione. Non so quello che non so e so di non sapere.
Sono un cittadino finlandese che è nato, cresciuto e ha lavorato tutta la mia vita negli Stati Uniti. Sono stato in Finlandia in vacanza 6 o 7 volte per alcune settimane alla volta. Ho qualche famiglia lì. Parlerò molto più finlandese prima di andare in pensione.
Andrò in pensione tra 10 anni a 53 anni. Ho intenzione di vivere sia in Finlandia che in America e di possedere una casa in entrambi i paesi. Non ho intenzione di lavorare in nessuno dei due paesi a meno che la Finlandia non me lo richieda per motivi fiscali o qualcosa del genere.
Avrò circa $ 150.000 USD all’anno di reddito dopo il pensionamento.
Voglio possedere un [vacation] casa in Finlandia e vivere lì per una parte dell’anno. Un appartamento o una casa a schiera. Se tutto va bene, un appartamento con 2 camere da letto a Tampere.
Il mio mutuo americano verrà estinto prima di allora. Quindi avrò solo un mutuo per la casa finlandese. Spero di ripagare il prestito finlandese secondo un programma tipico. Se il tasso di interesse è troppo alto posso pagarlo con una somma forfettaria prima di andare in pensione.
Le mie domande riguardano principalmente i requisiti di reddito, le attività bancarie e gli alloggi. Avrò un reddito da una pensione governativa statunitense e dai miei conti pensionistici (457b, 401k, Roth IRA).
Ho intenzione di tornare di nuovo in Finlandia tra qualche anno e voglio iniziare parte del processo in modo da non dover affrettare nulla.
Ho il mio numero di identificazione personale e il passaporto finlandese, ma non risiederò in Finlandia (finché non avrò acquistato questo appartamento). Voglio aprire un conto in banca e iniziare a spostare parte dei miei soldi per un fondo di emergenza per l’appartamento che comprerò. In questo modo, se le cose si interrompono, i fondi potrebbero essere più facilmente accessibili a livello locale.
Non ho esperienza con il sistema finanziario o bancario finlandese. C’è qualche motivo per cui non potrò aprire un conto bancario di base qualche anno prima dell’acquisto dell’appartamento? È un’azione sprecata? Non chiedo consigli sugli investimenti a meno che non vi sia un vantaggio nell’utilizzare un sistema di investimento finlandese per raggiungere questo obiettivo. Ho letto che la “prova di reddito” esiste. Devo semplicemente stampare alcune informazioni sull’account? Vorrei avere a portata di mano la documentazione adeguata.
Idealmente i miei figli (anche cittadini) utilizzeranno questo appartamento se andranno all’università in Finlandia. Un arco di tempo di circa 10 anni.
Mi piace fare le cose lentamente e con sicurezza.
Sia Google che ChatGPT non riescono a capire che sono un cittadino e continuano a parlarmi dell’ottenimento della cittadinanza come parte del processo. Vivere all’estero è qualcosa che la macchina non comprende bene, suppongo. Ammetto che non è un problema popolare da risolvere.
Per favore fatemi sapere quali ostacoli dovrò affrontare per questo piano o aiutatemi a creare un piano migliore.
Grazie!
di zeroabe
15 commenti
I think you need a permanent address in Finland to open an account here.
Opening a Finnish bank account without a registered address and a DVV registration is impossible. Maybe some digital banks would be helpful in this matter but not an actual brick and mortar bank.
since you are a citizen already I don’t think there is any income requirements
I think you could ask Finnish embassy for help regarding laws you are unsure about. As a citizen they should help you out. That said, as a citizen, I don’t think there’s too much bureaucracy stopping you from actually doing anything. Not sure if you need to pay attention to taxation etc.
Contacting a bank directly to ask about becoming a customer should be easy enough. What documentation etc. they need. Nordea is largest bank I think. Just contact one of them, you can chose another later. I assume they all require similar things.
I know USA does strange things for taxing their overseas citizens. Check out that bureaucracy before you transfer any assets out. You may be required to keep them informed of your money on foreign accounts or something.
I hope they change rules that tuition come online for people who haven’t paid a single dime for Finnish system as a tax money.
It sounds like you should have a relationship with a bank. Keeping an account while residing outside of EU is already very hard, many people have gotten their accounts closed. You also want also to do business while being presumably liable to US taxes, this also makes you less wanted customer for the banks.
I know banks can get you a mortgage when you move if your situation is good business for them. I had a friend move back to Finland from Switzerland and they were able to negotiate a mortgage before becoming residents.
Alternative: can you buy the apartment with cash? Then you don’t need to deal with the mortgage and any local EUR bank account should be good (as long as a US taxation person is accepted as a customer).
A rowhouse is 400 000 euro if you pay by cash you dont need a loan?
As others have said, it is impossible currently to get a bank account in Finland unless you have a Finnish address. This is a royal pain. The embassy is also largely unhelpful in most matters I have dealt with them on. Classic finnish bureaucracy in my opinion and nowhere near as customer-service oriented as American equivalents. You can consider, as a rather cumbersome alternative, purchasing a property outright and then establishing enough of a residency to establish a bank account. Cheap properties can be had for under $40k, though not in Tampere.
Additionally, you do not mention what your personal situation is. You should consider also what inheritance will look like for your children if you have any. Finnish inheritance laws are much more cumbersome than American ones.
I’m also a dual-citizen, located in the US, whose parents just recently bought property in finland. DM and I’d be happy to chat via phone if you’d like, including to practice your finnish.
EU banks also will request a proof of address when you want to open an account. Utility bill addressed to you in the address you are using in the application is usually sufficient.
As a citizen you can be in the country no questions asked. I would triple check with the tax authorities of both countries before you do anything because taxation might just ruin your plans.
First, you need to be careful with the tax situation. Keep in mind that if you are being deemed as a tax resident in Finland, you’d likely pay closer to 50% tax on your pension income (you can deduct any tax paid in US, though).
Below are some thoughts of what I have learned as another Finnish citizen, who’s lived abroad in the past. This is not legal/tax advice and I highly recommend to talk to a tax consultant about your situation.
In short, there are two key concepts:
– 6 month rule, if you reside in Finland more than 6 months, you become a tax resident. This can also happen if in a rolling period of 12 months, you visit Finland on shorter trips and that adds up to 6 months or more.
– Main abode and home: currently your home and family is in the US and even if you buy an apartment in Finland as a holiday home, you will likely not become a tax resident. However, if e.g your children move over to Finland to study and/or your apartment in Finland is considered as your primary home, then you can become a tax resident even if you stay in Finland below the 6 month rule requirement. This piece is a bit subjective and based on ties, family, housing etc. for each country.
Also, if you don’t pay tax and the Finnish tax agency determines that you should have been a resident historically, you will have to pay any taxes owned for past years plus an interest rate. With your income, this can be a lot.
The below guide from the Finnish tax man is reasonably good:
https://www.vero.fi/en/detailed-guidance/guidance/48999/tax-residency-nonresidency-and-residency-in-accordance-with-a-tax-treaty–natural-persons4
Also, for getting a mortgage to buy an apartment in Finland without a permanent residence and income – I have done this myself, so it’s possible. However, I had a relationship with the bank and was moving back to Finland, but used foreign income as the proof of income. Thus, your situation might be different.
When it comes to taxing in Finland I have a feeling that there was this way to avoid getting taxed, as long as you can prove that it is your own income that has been taxed in a different country and for sure is not a gift (aka no origin can be proven). I am not 100% sure about this one though, and should be checked from Vero.
Someone I know couple of years ago got a lot of cash for their wedding, and what essentially they were told to do was that if they deposit up to 3000e/month that won’t be taxed as a gift tax. So this can be an option for the day to day living. Bring cash, change to euro, deposit to account monthly. Again, the cap amount should also be double checked from Vero.
I find it curious that you have to have a permanent address to open an account, I didn’t know about it. What do people do when they have lived here their whole lives and then move away, do they just have to pack away their accounts completely?
I imagine though that a lot of things will be easy to handle, since you already are a citizen.
Also, in my experience, Nordea has been the most English speaking friendly bank. Maybe other banks have changed up a bit over the years, but just FYI.
You should simply contact a bank (I recommend contacting all of them tbh) and ask these questions.
US-Finland tax treaty says I will report my income to both and indicate which one I am paying my income tax to – to be sure that I am paying taxes and only to one. So at least that is kind of sorted.
Property taxes and other things I expect will be taxed locally, which I don’t mind.
Non taxable gifts are good to know about. Maybe do this for my children’s accounts to get them started.
Opening a bank account in Finland will be quite difficult for a US citizen if not impossible, unless you move your permanent residency there. Most Finnish people who have moved to the US and obtained dual citizenship status have lost their Finnish bank accounts in the past couple of years. I too lost mine that my parents had opened for me in the early 1970s. Having a condo and therefore a Finnish address didn’t help.
The banks do not want to comply with the reporting requirements from the US government and hence simply terminate the customers who they would have such reporting obligations for. While you have your residence in the US, you will not be able to invest in Finland either (stock, mutual funds, etc.), so your emergency fund would not earn you any passive income.
When you come to Finland, you will be able to use your US credit cards, and with e.g. Wise you’ll be able to move money back and forth fairly seamlessly, and make euro payments to Finnish bank accounts. There are some services in Finland, which require a local phone number or a bank account (like Mobilepay for instance), and dealing with those situations is annoying.