Uomo che porta a casa i suoi strumenti di giardinaggio arrestati dalla polizia armata di Manchester

I get why he accepted the caution – funnily enough, I was in another discussion recently on here about how people “act” in custody, regarding carrying items of self defence. I.e., that while you think you can talk your way out of something, and that you’ll just go “no comment” blah blah, custody is a scary, horrid, place that normal right minded folk don’t generally find themselves in – and if you ever do, your number 1 goal will be to get out no matter what.

Unfortunately, this is a catalogue of mistakes from his side. Maybe he had a reasonable excuse for carrying them, but carrying them in a way that they’re so accessible really doesn’t help and, honestly, his choice of tools is not particularly great. I have to transport items that would generally be unlawful to own, let alone carry, by most people, and if I’m in the car they ALWAYS go in the boot. And if on my person, I’d put them at the bottom of a rucksack or something – though would avoid that at near all costs.

Then, of course, as per para 1 – he’s not enjoyed the sitting-in-a-cell experience and has unfortunately accepted a caution. I think he’ll find that very very hard to “overturn” – it’s like overturning a guilty plea.

Without knowing what happened in custody or what this garden vest and tools look like, this is a real catch 22 for Police. Like most of these sensational stories there is probably way more to the story than being reported. They cannot just ignore a report of someone armed with a knife. The article mentioned “they couldn’t get hold of a solicitor”. Did he say he had his own solicitor and couldn’t get a hold of him? I’m pretty sure there are always duty solicitors available. You are allowed to carry certain bladed articles for a lawful reason so again I’m thinking there’s a bit more to the story than being reported.

“They started asking questions, like if I was autistic or anything like that, asking me whether I’d ever been in the army, whether I told people I was in the army”-these are questions that a custody Sgt has to ask anyone to who’s been arrested.

I’m very skeptical of this. I’ve known people to lie about the circumstances of accepting a caution and make false and malicious complaints about the investigating officer when they’ve realised that accepting a caution will shown on a DBS check. That being said, it’s not outside of the realms of possibility that this has been an error on the part of those officers.

Also that trowel is for all intents and purposes a knife, it looks nothing like a trowel and is from a brand that your average firearms officer will never have heard of. I can see why they arrested him.

Seems like the more he talked, the bigger the hole he kept digging for himself.

The police shouldn’t have brought this guy in for questioning. I mean, the implements he was carrying can look like blades but they really aren’t. And him carrying a trug of vegetables should have tipped the cops off that the man was indeed gardening.

He’s completely fucked himself by talking to police without a solicitor and then accepting a caution without understanding (because he didn’t have a solicitor) that it is an admission of guilt of a crime and pretty much impossible to get rid of afterwards.

Never, ever talk to the police. They are dangerous people with the capability to totally ruin your life and there is no requirement for them to be fair, honest, intelligent, or diligent.

As someone who has a hori hori, don’t wear it on a belt and walk around with. It’s an amazing gardening tool especially for an allotment, but it does look like a weapon.

For the avoidance of doubt, transport it in a way where it can’t be immediately brought into use (sheathed and wrapped in a towel at the bottom of a bag) to be safe.

If I would be carrying a tool like that to my allotment it would be sheathed and deep in a bag or rucksack. From the article, if sounds like it wasn’t and he was just holding it.
It helps if the bag wouldn’t just contained that, and it has other gardening tools, like a little trowel and some seeds and whatnot. Not required, but helps paint a much different picture if stopped.

He is guilty of “carrying an article with a blade or point or an offensive weapon in a public place”. It wasn’t for his work per se, or for religious or ethnic costume reasons. A Niwaki Hori Hori gardening trowel is indistinguishable from a knife or dagger as far as most people are concerned and would be a horrifically offensive weapon if used as such. [https://www.niwaki.com/s-type-hori-hori/#P00658-1](https://www.niwaki.com/s-type-hori-hori/#P00658-1) Whilst he has been stupid/unlucky he is still guilty and “ignorance of the law is no excuse”. If he gets away with it, every gang member and scrote will take up gardening!

When I used to fence they said that when carrying our swords in public we had to cover the blade in an old tie. By the time we stopped we had to have special cases. They said it was the same with basically any tools as well. 

Yeah most reasonable people aren’t gonna bother a guy with a hammer hanging off his belt or a shovel on his shoulder but you want to set yourself up for success. 

It’s funny how the tone of the article is all about how it’s only gardening tools and the police have gone way overboard, but they also provide the exact products so you can google and see how much like offensive weapons these tools actually look. I wonder if he was trimming his hedge samurai style, noises and all 🤣

Niwaki Hori Hori really does look like a dagger. Some look a bit like a Rambo knife or a heavy duty tactical knife.
The Japanese Garden sickle looks like some sort of martial arts weapon from Enter the Dragon.

He was wearing them on his belt (yes the do come with belt sheaths) but they dont need to be belt mounted.

He was walking down the street.
His belt (in the article image) is a military webbing belt.

So it’s not unreasonable to see and report someone walking down the street with what looks like weapons on a tactical belt.

So whilst he may not have had malicious intent, he wasn’t exactly doing himself any favours being in public like that.
A more sensible approach would have been to put them all in a rucksack.
Maybe the police should have been more sympathetic, but if this guy HAD been intent on mischief, they couldn’t really have handled it any differently.

Was an official caution warranted? I don’t know the guidance, but if this guy was found doing something similar again, what should the police have done (and how would they know)?

He sounds a bit put upon but is also a clueless dick.
That’s not a trowel. It is a knife. Wearing on your belt
is asking for the wrong kind of attention.

I carry a bowie knife with me when I shoot archery.
(How else do I get arrows out? )
But I keep it in the bow box. Not on my belt.

A hori hori might be an exceptional gardening tool, but if you don’t look at it and think “yeah that’s a bit iffy to be carrying around” and then go one step further by wearing it prominently on your belt, you’re the only one to blame for getting in trouble, and that’s without even considering the sickle. If I’ve got to transport so much as a handsaw outside of my house, I’m doing my best to keep it out of view. This guy’s a bit of a numpty imo. I do hope he has the caution removed from his record, he doesn’t deserve it for being daft, but he should also accept that this was totally his own fault.

Working in theatre and having an allotment; guy probably thought he could middle class his way to and fro with a knife and sickle. The police also likely realised he was no threat but didn’t want to look like planks descending onto a gardener with guns over nothing. Low trust society vibes.

> Rowe is now seeking legal representation to try to challenge his arrest and his caution. He is worried it will affect his future employment, as part of his job involves working with vulnerable adults.

Doesn’t he need to sign to accept a caution which goes onto his legal record?

There seems to be a lot to arrest this person for.

Carrying some garden tools (even if it is a “Japanese sickle”) wouldn’t appear to be one of these.