Essendo stato in molte capitali d’Europa ho trovato incredibile che Roma fosse così sporca. Tipo, incredibilmente sporco. Semplicemente non capisco.
Sono stato in altre capitali popolate come Berlino, Madrid e Parigi e sì. Erano sporchi. Ma questo era fuori dal centro e non in tutti i quartieri in cui ho girato. A Praga o Varsavia è praticamente impossibile trovare un simile stato di cose. A Budapest fuori dal centro ho trovato solo mozziconi di sigarette sparsi ovunque.
Ma non importa dove camminassi a Roma (trastevere, vicino a Città del Vaticano, vicino al Colosseo, vicino a campo dei fiori e porta san paolo), ci sarebbe spazzatura in giro o bruciata, graffiti OVUNQUE e i marciapiedi/strade mostrano segni di non essere curati da molto tempo.
Quindi volevo chiedere e farmi un’idea di cosa sta succedendo.
È sempre stato così? È una questione di budget o…? Ci sono stati tentativi ultimamente per risolvere il problema? (Si tratta di un punto di conversazione nella vita quotidiana/scena politica o è stato semplicemente normalizzato?)
Mi sconcerta semplicemente che una città così storica sia lasciata così.
EDIT: Grazie mille per le risposte a tutti. Ho imparato un paio di cose sull’Italia che non sapevo.
EDIT 2: Giusto per non perderlo tra i commenti. Per favore leggi questo: https://www.ilpost.it/2020/02/12/salvare-roma-crisi-elezioni/
Grazie u/Final-Inspector8023 per averlo condiviso.
di PayOdd92
43 commenti
The company that manages trash in Rome is famous to be a tool for corruption.
Essentially every time a politician needs to do a favour to someone, they give that someone a job at the trash company in Rome.
The people working there are there only to collect the paycheck.
Low budget, bad economy, a lot of unpaid taxes and Italians have a terrible sense of civic duty and are terribly selfish.
Source: Italian expat
Mafia.
Doesn’t get more simple than this.
If it’s unexplainable by logic, most of the times in Italy, that’s the mafia involved.
Could be safety checks, could be lobbies, could be hacks, could be public transport or very often waste collection.
It’s highly integrated and most of the times almost invisible, or well, visible enough that you know, I know, everyone knows, but no one knows.
Real attempts? No. Mostly just talks and very lobbied and flexible terms and wordings and such, vague hints. Basically nothing.
Voting will not change a thing, you just swap puppets and scapegoats.
Will we do something about it? No. Not until everyone in the middle class will get touched by the problem, for now it’s just something that you are angry about, but no one is remotely angry enough.
Also, there are a lot of bigger problems, so we’re kind of stuck.
The truth that many don’t want to hear is that Rome transitioned from being the most corrupt inept country in Europe (the Vatican state in the 19th century) to being the capital of the Italian state.
The local culture is famously still one of “menefreghismo” ie lack of care for problems. The city is administered this way at all levels, with few exceptions. Unfortunately also many central functions of the Italian state are managed by the same people.
It’s a rather unpopular opinion, but I firmly believe Italy would be a different country were the capital located in any other city.
Because Italy is a poor country inhabited by rich people. For decades, public property has been viewed as something for the “common folk.” Public transportation? “A way to move the poor around.” Public beaches? “For the beggars.” A dirty table? “The cleaning lady will take care of it anyway.” Public parks? “That’s where the drug addicts hang out,” and so on.
Then in Rome, you have to factor in corruption, outdated infrastructure, and the city’s messed-up organization following the economic boom.
It was even worse a few years ago. It’s a combination of things. It’s like this in all Italy with various degrees. Basically most Italians don’t view public property as “property of everyone” but as “property of no one” therefore they won’t care if it’s neglected or dirty. Politicians are constraint by budget, don’t have the will to fix things proper (because their electors don’t care) or are straight up incompetent. The fact that tourists keep coming no matter what makes things worse.
Edit: a note on neighbourhoods like Trastevere, testaccio, campo de fiori: run down buildings, sidewalks streets etc are part of the charm of these. So they’re kept like this on purpose
I would guess the structure of the city is very inefficient and old. And the way too many tourists don’t help.
In the end the fault is of the inhabitants, they decide how much people to take, how much to invest into public transport, and how much of the city to close for pedestrians.
Rome is the political capital, but not the economic capital (that would be Milan), but the immigramts from all over the country for obvious reasons did not take that into consideration.
This means that city maintenance is, essentially, permanently underbudgeted for a city its size. Couple this with trash collection becoming extra expensive due to NIMBYs (Rome’s usual landfill was closed in 2011, and since then there has been an eternal dance of who, among the outlying areas, gets an incinerator) and general inability of some people to dispose of trash correctly or not graffiti walls, and you get the current sitiation.
Mind you, this is an improvment since a few years ago, when sanitation workers outright skipped work because they felt like it.
Because the Italians are
https://preview.redd.it/2m0on970bmfh1.jpeg?width=640&format=pjpg&auto=webp&s=fce8534cba35137b035e84ab4441d5390f312d76
It is largely a budget issue, since Italy joined the EU (and a whole 10-15 years before that) it’s been subject to harsh austerity, over the years more and more budget constraints have been introduced, especially local administrations face unsurmountable challenges, but people prefer to blame the locals or corruption instead of addressing the underlying systemic issue largely due to ignorance
As an immigrant and Rome resident, I think in general Italians are a bit lazy, so I don’t think they have the will to fix all the wrong things with their country. I think they would be much further a head if they really cared
prendi una cartina geografica, vedi Roma dov’è tra il nord e sud delle città che ritieni più pulite. Se vai a nord la pulizia aumenta, se scendi sotto Roma, al sud, peggiora. Nulla di nuovo sotto il sole: prossimi al terzo mondo!
The Roman like to blame the tourists or anything else except themselves. That’s why.
also let me add that they always have an excuse “welll but Rome is 3928272x bigger than (any city that comes to your mind) city out there!!!1!1!1!1 Rome has so much more history than the whole world” they are just stuck in the past and clearly suffer from some complexes, where it’s inferiority or superiority complex I wouldn’t know, but the only thing they do is making comparisons with other cities to make Rome look better lol.
Throwing trash is extremely complicated. Rigid rules on household trash, they come to check your trash and give you fine if you don’t separate properly, no common trash can in the street afraid that someone may trow household staff there, no incinerators because everyone has a second home or garden somewhere and collute to not have any incinerator or garbage field close to their home and the classic lack of resource to find people who make the city dirty, unfortunately a small minority of people do it but the effect is greater, because each resource is calculated for an exact amount without any margin error, a bit like when toilet paper started going missing in supermarket a small increase in sale created a disaster.
Because the branch of the public administration that should be cleaning is full of people who don’t do their job and has been hired to buy their votes. Then comes the so called “Broken Windows Thoery” that causes people to get used to dirt and decay and so contribute to it.
Rome is an extremely difficult city to manage for this aspect for various reasons (among others):
– Ineffiecient architecture, roads and services due to historical reasons
– Large city area, but not so large a population and therefore more cost of maitenance per capita
– Largely inefficient trash collection company that could certainly do better
– Coincidence of very large volumes of tourism and vacation period for city workers.
– Road works and infrastructure works typically happen in this period when there is less car traffic from locals.
Besides this, every once in a while, there are also workforce dynamics and strikes with the trash company that results in areas that are less taken care of. Not sure about the state recently, but it happens from time to time.
Perché ai romani non frega proprio niente della loro città, si offendono se glielo fai notare, ma la realtà é che si regge tutto su un sistema di favori e corruzione e sembra star bene a tutti che rimanga cosi, anzi spesso e volentieri votano proprio in base a questi parametri, non ne é esente nemmeno Milano da questa dinamica, ma a Roma se ci abiti un paio di anni cominci a renderti conto che é cosi ad ogni livello.
I wonder how many people that replied in this thread actually live in Rome at the moment.
I’m not gonna argue that popular spots in Rome can be full or trash or generally unkept. But saying that nothing will change or the current admin (especially the mayor) is corrupt and does not care or is a puppet is blatantly false.
Especially compared to the previous admin (Raggi) the current mayor has taken MASSIVE steps in improving the city. Are they perfect? No, but managing such a big city needs a complete rework of the current system, far beyond what a single mayor can do in one course
È comico come tutti danno la colpa a chi è sopra di loro mettendo in mezzo mafia, corruzione e poteri forti.
Questa è una città piena di zozzoni, incivili e i turisti imparano subito e li imitano alla perfezione.
Poi c’è l’azienda della pulizia strade che è composta da una mandria di scansafatiche e dirigenti raccomandati et voilà, la discarica è servita.
Because Italy is the most westward eastern European country
I agree with all the points about corruption, mismanagement, and lack of care. But it’s also a vicious cycle: when tourists arrive and see trash everywhere, many immediately lower their standards and do the exact same thing, making a bad situation ten times worse.
I’ve seen piles of empty water bottles around the colosseum and is not locals that go there.
it’s 100% on the locals, lack of work ethics and ethics overall
as a kid (’80) I visited and remember people reading the newspaper on the streets and when they were done threw it on the ground. Entire newspaper!
whoever blame the administration (any administration) is delusional
I suggest you to read this book: The History of the Decline and Fall of the Roman Empire of Edward Gibbon. As you have seen during your visit the fall of the city is something that will never ends.
Many reasons, but the incredible (and ever-increasing) amount of tourism that Rome gets plays a role for sure. The other cities you mentioned get far less. Resources are just stretched thin because at all times you have hundreds of of thousands of extra people going around.
I mean, can’t they at least fix up the colosseum? The place is in fucking ruins
It’s not just Rome. It’s the whole country like that
Self defense.
House prices are high enough already, can you imagine what would happenif Rome was as clean as a Spanish city or, god forbid, a northern city?
I’m shivering just thinking about it.
Because they already did everything, they don’t need to prove anything to anyone anymore. They are the Saitama of European cities.
/s
I
Always been pretty much like this, maybe even a bit better lately. People born in Rome enjoy this. They don’t see the problem. Even people from other parts of Italy find it disgusting but people born in Rome are ok with it.
certo che è sporca
dove pensi li buttiamo i rifiuti? su marte?
se non costruiscono quel cavolo di termovalorizzatore a santa palomba, continueremo a essere considerati ‘i zozzoni d’italia. esportiamo i nostri rifiuti e paghiamo. la tari la paghiamo bella cara.
fosse per me la farei apgare a tutti quegli enti e quei c0glioni che si oppongono alle grandi opere, poi vediamo come diventano contrari allo sviluppo economico.
Va à Naples …
I don’t know. But I’ve always lived in touristic villages. And you were always well aware of the arrival of the hord… er, of the tourists from Rome. Cars left running in front of the shops, parking on the crossing lanes, misuse of the public recycling bins, cigarette butts everywhere, bar tables permanently occupied by ugly slackers with peanuts and trivial aperitifs.
too many engineers
[https://www.ilpost.it/2020/02/12/salvare-roma-crisi-elezioni/](https://www.ilpost.it/2020/02/12/salvare-roma-crisi-elezioni/)
this newspaper piece is kind of old as of 2026 but imho it is still an interesting account worth reading if you are into the matter. Ofc it’s in italian but I guess that any LLM can provide a good enough translation for you to follow along
i romani non sono più onesti dei napoletani, questo è il risultato.
Why is italy so dirty/decaying*
Because we spend money on film festivals which are more important
Nothing to do with the importation of hundreds of thousands of migrants from 3rd world countries I am sure…
I am Italian but from Milano.
Romans are really uncivilized.
Rome has historically a problem with organized crime, such as the Casamonica family and much more that I don’t really remember.
Many politicians as well live in the very town centre for example and since many years they don’t do a “housing reform class” (riforma del catasto) because it would them cost much more in term of taxes.
There is a big problem as well of inequality and organized crime especially in the social housing areas (case popolari) like Torbella Monaca.
It is a structural problem that Italy has from many years and the same people are quite uncivilized that are not able to accept big reforms
Regarding graffiti it’s a cultural thing, most people somehow got used to it and the ones that complain get attacked by those so called “artists” that view their name written on a wall as some incredible way to have freedom and self expression. The average roman basically only starts noticing it after staying for a while in a city that doesn’t have them and then coming back
Sometimes I think, if Rome were in Japan, it would be the most astonoshing city in the world.