"Un passaggio sorprendente nell’accordo di coalizione è anche il “passare a un intervallo dotato per l’esempio svizzero”. Quella frase porta chiaramente un timbro N-VA. Per anni, il partito sostiene la demolizione di linee transnazionali – “Nessuno si impegna da Ostend a Euper o da Anversa a Charleroi” – e per l’introduzione di connessioni ferroviari più brevi e decentralizzate su misura per il traffico effettivo della navetta."
Bene, immagino che nessun ragazzo N-VA abbia mai preso il treno da Ginevra per raggiungere un incontro a Zurigo o Basilea, o mentre viveva a Luzern Go a prendere il suo volo all’aeroporto di Ginevra senza dover cambiare treno. La cosa principale in Svizzera è che la rete ferroviaria combina linee nazionali e quelle locali, e sono tutte di proprietà di entità pubbliche (principalmente cantoni e comuni) e dove non esistono binari l’auto postale completa il viaggio. Ciò consente a qualcuno di continuare a vivere a Delémont mentre lavorava a Yverdon-les-Bains (vero caso che conosco), o qualcuno che vive a Nyon per entrare in tempo per l’incontro a partire dalle 9.30 a Zurigo (una cosa molto comune non vale anche la pena menzionarla). Se non riesci a lavorare, per esempio, a Liegi, mentre vivi, per esempio, Kortrijk, è perché non ci sono trasporti pubblici che lo rendono possibile, non viceversa.
In che modo è arrivato che qualunque sistema di trasporto pubblico la Svizzera sia in grado di offrire nonostante l’enorme pedaggio che quegli inverni duri che affrontano l’infrastruttura ferroviaria attraverso le Alpi, il Belgio non è in grado di fare in un semplice territorio piatto? Politica, forse? Mentalità? Solo chiedendo.
"Een treinnetwerk naar Zwitsers model"
byu/ApprehensiveFall9705 inbelgium
di ApprehensiveFall9705
11 commenti
Switzerland is loaded, so there’s that. It makes no sense to have all the IC trains cross Brussels, the bottleneck is real and causes so many problems.
Not a fan of closing stations though.
On one hand they are complaining that people from Wallonia should learn Dutch and be willing to travel to Flanders to find work.
But then they also want to eliminate transport options for that same commute?
They shouldn’t pretend this has anything to do with efficiency but jus with the NVA wanting to split up as many things as possible…
Super excited for pretty much every government or government-funded service to deteriorate significantly over the next four years and then be blamed on the previous government. Also I wonder if the smoothbrains who just took office realize that if all these newly disaffected passengers took to the road we would have easily twice as much traffic as now.
Investment and planned years ahead. So you want a extra train from the Netherlands to Brussels in ten years, so we going to plan new track, new switches…
They want that the trains follows the needs, we all know it don’t work like that, it is an euphemism for less trains.
If you want that trains stops and return in Brussels you need to reduce the trains by like 50 procent unrealistic.
And there is no staff anymore, people ready to drive a train, planned every day? 2 train drivers a day in oost-vlaanderen. No staff in stations enz…
And the way the government deals with companies like nmbs, every noob of the parties thinks to know how an good trains system works, where they can reduce costs….
[https://www.reddit.com/r/trains/comments/34ec5h/let_me_explain_to_you_how_the_swiss_railway/](https://www.reddit.com/r/trains/comments/34ec5h/let_me_explain_to_you_how_the_swiss_railway/)
for smaller stations, they could use the Norwegian model, where a lot of stops are “on call” only. pretty much like busstops: they only stop there when someone needs to get on or off at that stop.
Bepaalde zaken zijn de logica zelve. Andere suggesties maken het spoor klaar om overgemaakt te worden aan de gewesten.
Dat we geen grote investeringen in het spoor of de dienstverlening moeten verwachten, dat staat buiten twijfel.
Fun discussion this.
I want to tackle your example first of working and living far away in your example the road distance (station to station) is 115km. Driving this distance takes around 1h30 minutes. By train this would either take 1h17 or 1h43.
Your other example Liège to Kortrijk also station to station is just shy of 200km. Driving this distance takes around 2h. By train this would take around 2h10min
I would not wish either commute on anyone although there are plenty of people who do that or have even longer commutes.
Your other example from Nyon to Zurich is a train journey of 2h47min. I’m not sure how many people actually do that but seeing that travel time I think you vastly overestimate the amount.
I think the article goes to explain our problem with trains quite well. It’s mainly twofold:
1) North/South Axis: it’s congested and would take ages to expand and be hugely expensive because of the swampy terrain.
2) Most of rail is only 1 track between destinations. Aka fast train would not be able to get by slower trains.
Solutions:
1) Either you take the big financial hit on expanding this axis but the financial burden is high. You only need to look at Metro3 to see how quickly drilling tunnels can become rapidly expensive.
OR
You arrange travel in a differed way. By starting point you don’t let trains go past South or North and put trains that basically act as belt between North and South. Diverting trains to West/Schuman can also ease the pain but will require people to switch more often.
2) Well only 1 option there, you lay more tracks. Also hugely expensive.
Snake under the grass (“adder onder het gras”)
Train tickets in Switzerland are generally more expensive than in Belgium. Swiss rail travel is known for its high quality, punctuality, and extensive network, but it comes at a premium.
# Price Comparison:
* **Switzerland:** A standard ticket for a medium-distance journey (e.g., Zurich to Bern, about 120 km) costs around **CHF 50–60 (€50–62)** one-way in second class. A shorter trip, like Zurich to Lucerne (about 50 km), costs around **CHF 25–30 (€26–32)**.
* **Belgium:** A similar journey (e.g., Brussels to Liège, about 100 km) costs around **€20–25** one-way in second class, and a shorter trip (e.g., Brussels to Ghent, about 50 km) is around **€10–12**.
Prices are very much different (lower) if you have a season ticket, “half price pass”, or any other formula.
But what BDW is really saying, is that train tickets –in general– will get a lot more expensive.
Same way trains are avoiding paris to go south. By going to Marne la valee instead of paris centre
I agree. I lived there for 3 years and I know what you mean. It’s a good network. Although towards the end of my stay I bought a car there as it was necessary.
Why would anyone want to commute from Liège to Kortrijk? There are physical limits to how fast a train can go, you need to have brain damage to even consider this.