L’UE vuole che la Turchia faccia parte di SAFE
https://www.ekathimerini.com/politics/foreign-policy/1283489/eu-wants-turkey-to-be-part-of-safe/
di Axmouth
L’UE vuole che la Turchia faccia parte di SAFE
https://www.ekathimerini.com/politics/foreign-policy/1283489/eu-wants-turkey-to-be-part-of-safe/
di Axmouth
31 commenti
> German Foreign Minister Johann Wadephul, who is visiting Greece on Monday, is expected to renew pressure on the government to drop its objections regarding Turkey’s participation in the European Union’s €150 billion Security Action for Europe (SAFE) program designed to boost investment in defense industries.
> The ratcheting up of pressure is also due to the fact that the deadline (November 30) for countries wishing to receive loans through SAFE is approaching.
> A few days ago, Prime Minister Kyriakos Mitsotakis met on the sidelines of the European Political Community (EPC) Summit in Copenhagen with German Chancellor Friedrich Merz, as well as NATO Secretary-General Mark Rutte, who had requested the meeting with the central issue on the agenda being the unblocking of Turkey’s participation in SAFE.
> Mitsotakis repeated Greece’s points, that Turkey cannot join SAFE unless it drops its threat of war if Greece were to extend its territorial waters in the Aegean and its theory of the “gray zones,” on the basis of which Ankara disputes Greek sovereignty over islands and islets in the Aegean.
> But, among EU members, only Cyprus and France share Greece’s objections, even though many understand Greece’s stance.
> Practically all the other EU countries support cooperation with Turkey, as they consider the state with the second largest army in NATO and a flourishing defense industry to be a useful partner for Europe.
> The assessments of quite a few Europeans – mainly Easterners – that Turkey’s stance on Ukraine and its good cooperation with Russia could be ambivalent have been conveyed to Athens in various ways, but they believe that at this stage, Europe needs both the industrial capabilities of the Turks and their willingness to get involved in active operations if required.
> Also, Greece’s reluctance to provide its aging Mirage 2000-5 fighters to other EU countries so that they, in turn, can provide Ukraine with these or other planes does not sit well with Eastern Europeans and other EU members.
> Scandinavian countries are also positive about Turkey and SAFE, even though two (Finland, and, especially, Sweden) recently became the target of Turkish obstructionism when they applied to join NATO.
I hate the fact that we’re still appeasing Türkiye.
They are literally occupying parts of an eu member, but ok
Turkey should be part of SAFE when all EU members feel safe with Turkey.
Hopefully Greece continues to veto this. There is no reason for them to facilitate their enemy from expanding their military even further.
Frankly, they should veto that unless there are very iron-clad security guarantees. Like Turkey being a NATO member should not at all be a factor that everyone else in NATO should wage war on Turkey if they attack. Not sure how the Greeks would look at this, but it would be entirely reasonable for them to also demand significant permanent NATO deployment.
It should be treated the exact same as Estonia invoking any article against Russia if they were to invade their territory.
I get that UK should be part of it, but Turkey is another autocracy that phantasises about expanding its territory into Europe and we should decrease our dependency on such countries.
Germany being Germany once again.
Haha!
No.
it is here important to say that there is a huge Turkish diaspora in germany, they vote usually for Erdogan from afar and they have also voting rights in germany (also occupying many government roles).
germany wants to keep them happy one way or another.
on other news
[Turkish UAV draws Turkish flag (using its flight path trace) south of Cyprus](https://www.reddit.com/r/europe/comments/1o3e9hc/turkish_uav_draws_turkish_flag_using_its_flight/)
Not a surprise. One of the effects of denying them arms sales is that they’ve been putting a lot of effort into their own arms industry and now have quite an extensive one – doesn’t surprise me that other nations want to be able to buy their stuff as it’s probably good enough and available quickly.
Of course, not at all unreasonable for Greece to not want any of their money to go to Ankara’s arms industry, but equally if everyone else is cool with _their_ money doing so it seems unreasonable for Greece to be able to block it. Maybe some carveout needs to be arranged or something.
The UK isn’t allowed to be part of SAFE, but Turkey is. I suggest the UK stops trying to be nice to Europe and instead buddies up with China.
Turkey is not a reliable partner. It was not so long ago that Erdogan was blackmailing the EU by threatening to unleash immigrants.
Germany is being realist. When things will get serious, you will want Türkiye by your side.
We can cooperate with Turkey just fine without letting them join SAFE. It’s supposed to stimulate EU industry, not facilitate countries to keep buying everything externally because they seem allergic to developing domestic capabilities.
Totally in for deeper ties between Europe and Turkey. I still hope they’ll join EU one day.
Greece border and security are of course not on the table.
Both the UK and Turkey are integral to the european security architecture. There can be no serious strengthening of European defence without the inclusion of either nation – expecially in regards to combating Russa
As long as they occupy EU land they have no place in any EU programs.
eeeee NO???
Main reason Eu wants to connect with Turkey is the same reason US wants Turkey in Nato, Turkey is the spearhead for Nato also first war will it be when possible(impossible) war happen, since first Trump term USA wants to focus on china( with Israel its hard to do) so bc of that US getting out from Europe, who has the experienced decent army, Turkey, bc of that EU still looks from who can die first for us its the turks( its a cold war report for nato, Turkey would be the first contact), as a turkish, fuck this shitty thinking getting Turkey to die first, or eastern Europe or balkan countries, let the immigrants goes to western eu(germany, UK,france ((goverments responsible for the immigrant waves from Middle east) no bad thoughts for people)) destroy the system for making us dying for western countries, they are the reason for this nonsense, also USA for making this way
Germany saying Turkey should join, also saying Turkey has a government with Islamic far right government (true), also supports far right Islamic group in Turkey with ngo’s. It’s a shitshow from Germany like always
Absolutely not. Erdogan is already a fifth column in NATO, he should be kept tf away from the EU
people mock turkey but they are capable more than majority of eu armies combined. do you think when shits hit the fan they, would eu countries want turkish army by their side or greek one or dutch one or belgium one (wrote those countries because some of them wrote here) ?
apart from uk and france (countries with nuke) no other eu country match turkish armies’ output whether you like it or not. they have really strong momentum right now. actively trained and battle tested soldiers, active and strong going military tech industries (testing drones and other stuff at the hand of ukraine army). germany still 10 years away until they debate and slow things down for rheinmetal to catch up. spain, portugal, italy will not care if russia attacks baltic states and i doubt any eu country would willingly send their soldiers. everyone will call for action and expect other countries to do the heavy lifting. just like when poland (who was shouting the loudest) was proposing sending eu army to guard ukraine border but would not even send couple polish squads to that guard duty and expect other eu countries to send their soldiers. that is why eu wants turkish army. they believe giving turkey money would be enough to use their army in defense of europe. and in a way it might work. eu bribed turkey to hold immigrants at their border by giving money (it cost turkey way more to handle them but it is still a politics). before down-voting just think about a second like politician.
If you are in favour of Turkey why not let Russia in also. Turkey is occupying a European country rossia is doing even that. Ukraine is ally of Europe. Turkey has a casus belli with Greece and wants Greek territories. Russia is the same.
I hope EU collapse, when russian jets reminding you how fragile you’re these folks looking a fresh blod which is can be sacrifice for them for what? what reason turkey protect these people?
Ehh, not surprising.
Whether they are part of the SAFE or not, Turkish defense companies (like the Leonardo-Baykar partnership) will receive a share of the EU defense budget in various ways. This is inevitable
Welcome to the world of defense industry. If you’re not aligning with the Russia-China axis and your relationship with the US is strained, your options are really limited and you don’t have the luxury of being selective.
If we consider the US and the EU as two separate sides, it would also be wise to pull Turkey and Turkish MIC towards your side or at least away from the US side.
why link to this borderline golden dawn slop of a website?
>Practically all the other EU countries support cooperation with Turkey
Well, I understand why Greece and Cyprus are refusing.
Well I dont. They can be part of SAFE once they get the fuck out of Cyprus.
This will end up just like Russia, they continue to appease Turkey, until one day it attacks Greece or Cyprus and suddenly everyone is surprised. Turkey is a dictatorship just like Russia.
The whole goal of SAFE is for Europe to have more autonomy itself. Adding dependencies to an unreliable dictatorship that occupies and threatens war against EU member states is not what we want…
How can you tolerate this failed state (Greece), which cannot even stand on its own feet without the taxes paid by EU member country citizens?
(Note: Among those paying off the debt are Turkish taxpayers — whose number exceeds more than half of Greece’s population.) 😀
In a potential Russian invasion, would you rather have this failed state by your side on the front lines — one that has no combat experience and doesn’t even know how to fight — or an army with a serious defense industry and the world’s most battle-hardened forces?
(An impeccable army forged through over 40 years of the world’s most difficult warfare — guerrilla warfare — and still actively engaged today in close-quarters combat against terrorism in regions like Lebanon, Somalia, Iraq, Syria, and across Africa.)
The choice is yours… No problem for us! 😉